Good doctors with good bedside manner are hard to come by. school, simply because I want to be an M.D. Thanks for your replies. Thank you for your time and attention. That said, any US school (D.O. The majority of DO students are americans and will practice in America...so practice rights in other countries are irrelevent, though most modern countries has a pathway to licensure (the list is online). Start by using our medical school chance predictor to determine how competitive your MCAT and GPA scores are compared to the medical school's admission statistics. Check out our video for all you need to know about out of state friendly medical schools: If you're applying to medical schools outside of your home state, your applications really have to stand out in order to be successful. Ben - I think you made a great decision. AUC is in st maarten and this is a fun island. In the state of Newyork majority of physicians practicing in that state are foreign graduate. In evaluating this data they also took into account that some islands have more than one medical school. I hope you will not try to "defend" your degree your entire career, but rather embrace its differences. While schools typically publish their match results, it is unclear if these lists are truly comprehensive. i got 99's on my boards. I have nothing negative to say about any of the Caribbean schools, but be certain that you are going to receive the education they promise and consider re-applying to US schools if that is an option. i applied to surg on wednesday. I agree with the previous poster that it is simply a numbers game. I consider this as one of the best Caribbean medical school in teaching and it is cost effective. But we are not bush people either. In the late 1970’s three Caribbean medical schools were established: American University of the Caribbean, originally located on the Island of Montserrat, Ross University on the Commonwealth of Dominica, and St. George’s University in Grenada. Purposely 'weeding out' people=less money for the school in the long run=bad for business. I love your post and it's so very true. Rotations must be approved by the Accreditation Council for Graduate Medical Education  (ACGME). Don't limit yourself to just one school though and look into others as well. Like it or not, if it came down to a Carib grad and U.S. grad for a spot, the U.S. grad is getting first dibs. Admission Requirements. To be eligible for ACGME accredited residency programs in the United States, and for licensure in many states, students who graduate from a Caribbean medical school must obtain an ECFMG certificate. All core rotations and subinternships must be completed in hospitals with which the Caribbean medical school has an active, written affiliation agreement and which have appropriate clinical faculty members. In addition, what are we all becoming doctors for? One other thing to consider would be costs of attendance. As always, the top, high paying jobs in the U.S. go to people trainined at the top U.S. colleges/universities. Is your premed advisor well versed in the pros and cons of attending medical school in the Caribbean? Each academic year at SGU, about 600 students graduate with an attrition rate of 10-15%. JD: Based on my experience, Caribbean medical students who have outstanding scores, letters of reference, written documents, interview skills and guidance, can obtain competitive residency positions. MANY could not pass with the 90-95% failure rate of this "separate and unequal" exam. Ro, come on... you are obviously a pre-med with very little clue. Yes, those in academia or those with family and friends in medicine may know, but a lot don't. I don't personally care because I am sure your information comes from a select few on SDN and no experience as you are a junior in college but there are some people on this forum that will take offense to it. Try to find some high paid surgeons who went to school in the Caribbean; Try real hard. I won't go into the details but there is alot of behind the scene activities between schools like Ross, SGU with organizations like the AMA, sallie mae, us dept of education, etc.. to keep their affiliations with numerous acgme hospitals affiliations and federal loans in the US. The Ponce Medical School Foundation delivered the medication to four doctors in Puerto Rico, changing lives of hundreds of patients fighting cancer. I watched an MD kill a person once....do I think all MD's are idiots? If you do well on your boards then it will speak for itself. Kevin, I have personally spoken to chairs of several residency programs and they all said that it really does not matter if one is a US grad or a FMG. all of this depends on the specialty you choose to practice. It's not about how 'good' the programs are it's about how much weight it carries with employers. Even now, three years after the storm, thousands of homes are still damaged. Maybe the situation is improving, but before applying for Caribbean medical school admission, I would retake the MCAT, take some more science courses, work at a hospital for a little while and then reapply to US schools. I have a friend who went to a Caribbean school a few years ago. However, many of these students have no business being in medical school. If you get a score of above 20, you can give it a shot. By whom is the school run and what are the credentials of the academic faculty? The living conditions vary. Why are you looking at that school? By comparison, US schools accept fewer than 200 per year. To that end, they often employ instructors from English-speaking third world countries, they are located on islands with very low real estate and labor cost, and yet their tuition, housing, food services cost is more like out of state US tuition. Amy.....wonderful!!!! If someone feels that a Carib education is not at par, I say bring it on. Those are thoughts of the ignorant. Take a look out there though. The DO students do have the option of DO residencies but a high percentage do match to allopathic residencies and fellowship and this can be quantitatively shown that only about half of the DO residencies are filled...the rest of the classes went allo. Some schools offer a fifth semester, either in the Caribbean or in the US, to help students prepare for the USMLE Step 1 and transition to their clinical semesters. Their main concern is whether or not I provide them with good medical care. man, all you DO vs. MD guys are hilarious. I want to be a doctor more than anything. I will love to be a Doctor/Physician its just taking me sometime to get there. The only comment on this page that is truth and worthy of taking seriously. I was considering this option but it's too expensive and that i couldn't afford the tuition cost. Once your in a DO/MD program no one gives a crap except a handfull of programs and some of the more competative specialties. They are also listed with the Foundation for Advancement of International Medical Education and Research, an arm of the … Oh, you also may want to look into DO schools as well if you like the philosophy and this alternative take on medicine. My own personal bias against DO students is rooted in my own experiences with them. It would not be unheard for them to accept nearly 2000 students on a yearly basis. As I said before, just passing along information that was given to me at my interviews. If you are doing it "to get a job" or "make yourself more marketable", you are DEFINITELY doing it for the WRONG reasons. Those who CAN, make it through the other end, those who still CANNOT, get weeded out (at least at the big 3 Caribbean schools). What about PASSION? @ TK: thanks very much for your response. Not one time did I question the doc's knowledge, he/she was a doctor, enough to earn my respect. You're on your own. Its GPA this, MCAT score that. Carribean schools, above all else, are moneymaking machines: They do not serve a community of patients, and their only focus is the bottom line. As a graduate of Ross University I say this: Go to the Carribean if you can't get into osteopathic school. No. Look stuff up, your in medical school, so your bright. It's becoming increasingly more difficult for Puerto Rican doctors to get licensed in other states. I have known a few who are their way to becoming exceptional doctors. Get a life, become a doc! You comment was right on target and congratulations to you on a job well done. It sucks when you have to take a back seat to an american medical student......it almost takes the prestige away from that title of an MD....those long for. ", Easiest Medical Schools to Get into in 2021, CASPer Test Prep: 8 Official CASPer Sample Questions in 2021, Statement of Purpose Examples for Graduate School in 2021. Step 1 and Step 2 ck and cs are brutally difficult. I believe you make the school, not the other way around so if I get accepted I will try my best to make the best grades I can by using all the resources presented to me by the school so that I can get into a good residency. This means a single mistake with an exam in the ~70% range can cost you $15-20k in extra tuition plus an extra year of interest that adds up with your loans. Would somebody, with FIRST HAND experience/knowledge, please advise me on applying to a Caribbean Medical School. I think I would take a Caribbean MD (big 4 anyways) over some of the D.O schools. Don't distract yourself from things that you cannot control. I'm still waiting for AUC. I have seen students from these medical school match into competitive specialty and yes even neurosurgery, opthalmology e.t.c. Unlike most US schools, Caribbean medical schools typically have two to three first year classes that begin at different times during the academic year. Your comparison of FMG's being the same as American DO's is completely false as well. Caribbean med schools are much better at making money than they are at churning out future high paid doctors. All there! In recent years, Caribbean students with strong academic and clinical performances have been able to obtain competitive residency positions at an increasing rate. They do and will excell. You have much to learn young padawan. If you are planning to do this, please don't. The World Health Organization (WHO) does not accredit medical schools but maintains a list of schools that are recognized by local governments. That's why I chose D.O. After more more undergraduate classes, post-baccs, SMPs, and a few solid shots at the MCAT, THEN, one can shrug their shoulders and go Carib. Thanks. The medical education you will receive in the Caribbean varies tremendously, and the success you will have after graduation depends on many factors. You've got to to be 150% dedicated and disciplined. German medical schools are among the best in the world, and certainly on par with the top US schools. Don't believe anything you hear and don't worry about where people do their training programs; Find real surgeons who went down there for school. Respect others. This is not a generalization about community hospitals - these were our shared observations about a few particular hospitals. I'm a staff physician recruiter for placement firm that specializes in MD's. Do you read the message boards? I think reading the post especially Kevins, we are missing the whole point of medicine which is basically how well you treat, interact and provide care with the best of your abilities with your patients. Most of them were absolutely incompetent in mastering the material, and he said it's pretty safe to assume that the majority of them will not even pass. How do DOs usually do with emergency medicine? Cooperative Program between University of Puerto Rico Medical School, Yale School of Medicine & Yale Graduate School. Junior in college??? Does anyone have feedback on St. Matthew's Medical School? I also tried two Carib. Sugar coating aside, Caribbean students who are talented and motivated can excel. Does the school have more than one matriculating class annually and are admissions rolling? Research these schools carefully before you apply and commit thousands of dollars and hours. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. It's very discouraging, but there is a lot of competition for residencies and each year there are more applying for spots. school will lessen one's chances of attaining one of the more competitive residencies. Along the way however there were many individual mentors and hospitals that provided me with the opportunities that I needed to complete my training. Do well on your speciality boards and subspecialty boards and life will work itself out. I will never regret being a DO. Taken from the 2010-11 MSAR; San Juan Batista School of Medicine Ave GPA: 3.3 Ave MCAT 20....Ponce School of Medicine Ave GPA:3.6 Ave MCAT: 21.... Those are only 2 of the schools, but as you can see have a MCAT average is way lower, generally 5-6 pts below the ave MCAT at any given osteopathic school, and about 10 pts lower than other us allo schools. I regularly recommend DOs to my programs if they have good scores, LORs, and engaging. Even tough they know English, they are in a different language level as compared to the students in the USA. The curriculum is designed to deve… The recent disaster earthquake was in Haiti. Considering that there are primary care positions that remain unfilled every year, you are correct that these graduates will probably still match in spite of their bad scores. It really makes no sense though to increase the number of medical school graduates while not increasing the number of residency positions - this results in the exact same number of doctors, and all it does is making it harder for students to match. Good comments from everyone. The bottom line is that if there are more medical graduates, it will get harder for anyone to get a competitive residency, no matter if FMG or US grad. For US residents only. I'm telling you it's nearly impossible to become a high paid doc if you go down there, but do yourself a favor and try to prove me wrong. In the late 1970’s three Caribbean medical schools were established: American University of the Caribbean, originally located on the Island of Montserrat, Ross University on the Commonwealth of Dominica, and St. George’s University in Grenada. In fact there are not many stats like that at a number of middle tier M.D. You can even look into US accreditation for schools in Puerto Rico and the US Virgin Islands. If you want to be a physician I advise to stay away from message boards. but here in America, we have a deeply rooted system of medical education called osteopathy. Also does anyone know if the 4 better schools have pre med programs for high school graduates ? Living in the Caribbean can present many challenges for those who have never lived outside the United States. In fact, according to the AAMC, last year roughly 61% of matriculants attended medical school in their home state compared with 39% that chose an out of state medical school. I went to a state funded school and am in ENORMOUS debt. If students slip through the cracks of a U.S. medical school, then international med schools in the Caribbean may be the next choice. AUC's Providence Hospital (Michigan) is listed in the Top 50 US Hospitals, and its new clinical site in NYC is also a teaching hospital of SUNY-Stony Brook med school. Core clinical rotations and third and fourth year curriculum in Caribbean schools resemble those of US medical schools. Check out that link I posted before, USMLE scores aren't enough. You Americans think that you are it. You truly are misguided. Would be like me listening to a Junior in college about my DO program...wouldn't make much sense. Does the school provide guidance to help with the match process? Just because you went to say, for example, Harvard (because you got the grades) doesn't mean that you are going to make a good physician. I challenge you to find many different surgeons who went to school down there. If anything, I would be concerned that going to a D.O. You hear of success stories, of those that successfully matched, but they don't tell you about the more than 50% that don't match anywhere. For more details, see the ECFMG website at www.ecfmg.org. It will hit the Caribbean students and other FMGs, who did not do so well (low board scores etc.). JavaScript is disabled. Everything they do after the book work is all done stateside. I called a number of residencies. Sorry, but 9 out of 10 people with the stats you mentioned would wait it out a year and get into a U.S. school because it WILL improve one's chances of attaining a more competitive residency. Do you think that makes them a better doctor? The medical education you will receive in the Caribbean varies tremendously, and the success you will have after graduation depends on many factors. And what do you do for a living "Danny"? Kent you will receive a degree from St George's University. This is the single most important criteria in getting into residencies. The fact that medical schools are increasing class sizes and more medical schools are being established, but residency spots are not increasing is precisely the reason NOT to go to any foreign medical school if you want to practice in the US. Can students do away electives at nonaffiliated hospitals? I was warned that going to a foreign medical school would be a "dead end path". In the last four decades, the Caribbean has seen a steady increase in the number of medical schools on the islands as well as the size of their student bodies. It is a good option. The minimum requirements for admission are: A Bachelor’s degree or its equivalent (as determined by the Registrar’s Office) with a grade index of at least 3.00 overall and 3.00 in science subjects (on a 4.00 scale). When evaluating schools, it is important to ask what percentage of students who initially enroll in each class actually take and pass the USMLE Step 1 and successfully proceed to clinical rotations. Are the rotations ACGME accredited? If US medical schools are churning out the obnoxious, arrogant likes of that poster, I think the DO or FMS options are looking pretty attractive. are done stateside jus like every other med school. You have no idea what you are talking about Bridget, do you? Is going to a foreign medical school even a good option? All I can say by your comment, you honestly don't belong in medicine, in my view if you can't respect others. However, the largest number of students pursue less competitive specialties, such as internal medicine or family practice. Education in Puerto Rico is overseen by the Department of Education of Puerto Rico and the Puerto Rico Education Council.The Department oversees all elementary and secondary public education while the Council oversees all academic standards and issues licenses to educational institutions wishing to operate or establish themselves in Puerto Rico.. Instruction in Puerto Rico is compulsory between the … For applicant's that do not gain entry into a US allopathic school their first time around, would you consider Caribbean schools as being a better alternative to osteopathic schools if one primarily concerned with being able to practice in the US in a slightly competitive sub specialty? The osteopathic DO degree is a very strong alternative to the US-trained MD degree. It takes every ounce of dedication and hard work to pursue medicine and Carribean schools that are accredited are a good option for those who don't want to waste time trying to get into over saturated US med schools being rejected time after time. RE: "Dominican Republic medical schools are a joke…yes they required a BA/BS, MCAT and so forth…but if you got the cash you get even with less than two years of college, I have met people that were in medical schools in the Dominican Republic while finishing their undergraduate degree online and in the summer.". With the osteopathic route, you get to stay in the US for the entire four years instead of travelling thousands of miles away to a third world country. Classes are much more difficult, exams are harder, if you fail there are no retakes, you are just dismissed. Also, you will need to speak the language of instruction fluently, have an IB high school degree, and be a EU citizen in order to be considered. Given this, it is no wonder that so many students go to the Caribbean for medical school. Remember patient is "key" not school.This will become evident as you are aligned with resident doctors from a wide array of schools ...might be FMG, AMG, or Dos. No, I will not tell you the programs and I don't really see any need to explain why. There are SO many schools out there hurting the reputation of all offshore schools, even the good ones. Before applying for the residency match and early in medical school, students should strategically plan their clinical clerkships in the US, ideally arranging rotations in the settings where they prefer to match. A lot of us. Eat under a tree, get medicine from a bush etc. Please correct me if I'm wrong. You just want to be helped. “I think you are going to see a rebuilding of Puerto Rico,” he said. Similarly, if you have worked in a state or have studied there, this can help prove your love and connection to the state. He is now in residency. Just make sure you get a place with air conditioning. Its just that there wasn't enough seats. I don't know who this Kevin is that you speak of. Accreditation for Caribbean medical schools is on several levels, including local Ministry of Health accreditation by some  individual Caribbean country’s government, regional accreditation by organizations such as The Caribbean Accreditation Authority for Education in Medicine and Other Health Professions (CAAM-HP). While there are no guarantees in life, if becoming a physician is your life's goal, then use any pathway available. This is about Ben's post. This year was a harder match due to less spots per medical student and I'd be wondering how it would hit these Caribbean schools in the next couple years. Good luck to you! St. Matthew's University in Grand Cayman....2yrs there and the rest stateside. In those years they switched from the ECFMG to the dreaded two-day FMGEMS. I strongly believe that one can be a great physician from a Caribbean school and have met a number of very competent graduates. The only exception is if your Father has his own practice and he gives you a top position. With regards to attrition rates, this discussion should be reserved for people who complete their four years of medical education, and pass their USMLE exams. Thanks alot. As an FMG, it is VERY hard to get a residency spot and nearly impossible unless you want FM, IM, PEDS or Psych. To use attrition as a criticism of a school to me is silly. Are you that hung up on those two letters? What percentage of students are US citizens? Ontario has by far the most programs (six) and a … Thank you for sharing some hard core facts!!! "....forget about it" ?????? I am not against DOs, I myself would love to be a DO, but respect others and don't bash anyone. I'll take your advice about 'not believing anything I hear', starting with your post. Amy is an example that there are many highly qualified students, who did not get into US MD programs. She is currently trying to find a job and focusing on future examinations. programs. Well, if you really do not want to take it again, and therefore not apply to any of the other three, go ahead and apply to Saba. However, the attrition for those schools is high (arguably because thats part of their process) and many in fact do match into FP/IM. We can compare step scores! I am sharing what I was told point-blank by several program directors in anesthesia only. I am an American born graduate of a Caribbean Medical School (Ross University) and have been in practice for over 20 years. To me this seems like trying to compensate for a subconscious inferiority complex they have because of their DO degree, a degree which is legit and perfectly fine, but makes them different from the vast majority of other doctors. im currently a 3rd year student in pakistan at Dow International. How many DO's do you see in radiology, ortho, ENT, anesthesia, and all the primary care spots.....MANY. ... University of Puerto Rico School of Medicine (PR) Out-of-state tuition & fees: … No matter what medical school you attend, make the BEST of it & bring a POSITIVE ATTITUDE!!!! Just because you don't know much about Caribbean countries, it doesn't mean w'ere stupid. There certainly is some misinformation going both ways. are other reasons. Of course, connecting to loved ones has never been easier as video chat applications keep getting better, still, it's difficult to beat connecting in person. I am sick and tired of seeing people bash each other over where they went to med school on this website. Both of us work 2 jobs to pay his loans, and he constantly tries to get a better job, but too no avail. I am extremely happy with my education. Where do students live and what are the housing conditions? When determining whether or not you should study out of state, you should consider the following factors: Is medical school worth it? Does the school offer financial guidance to help students choose the best loans and make responsible financial decisions? I would never look down on them. I also agree that getting a great residency/fellowship program is more important than where one attended medical school. I mean, come on, that's weak sauce. © 2013-2021 BeMo Academic Consulting Inc. Cicero, a solid MCAT score disappears once you finally have your seat in med school. And the training difference is astonishing between the two places. I am really not planning to spend all my life practice practising in the US, i want to practice in Africa but i need the US experience stuff. America's Admissions Experts ... Medical Schools in Puerto Rico. I feel that DO is a better option because you learn hands-on manipulative skills in addition to the traditional MD education that you would not in the caribbean. Saba does not require the MCAT, just recommends it. Please.. My GPA is less than 3.5 (C in O Chem). If you do goto caribbean medical school. My son was recently accepted to an American Medical School and he was very fortunate. While they didn't mention DO schools, the implication was straightforward. A lot of them are not accredited, while two or three of them have had terrific success producing quality graduates. Another thing that applicants looking to apply to foreign medical schools should consider are the huge class sizes that might make it tough for some students to reach their academic potential. Do I need my BS or apply to Carribean med schools on January ? I did SAT2 - Biology (760), Chemistry (800) and Physics (780). 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